Talk:Żagiew: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia

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::Maybe we should clarify which scholars repead Bednarczyk’s theory? [[Tadeusz Piotrowski (sociologist)]] cited in the article is one. [https://www.ceeol.com/search/article-detail?id=161282] (article in [[:pl:Kwartalnik Historii Żydów]]) by [[Maciej Wójcicki]] (non-notable historian?) also seems to treat his view as correct. Not seeing much in English literature about this. [[User:Piotrus|Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus]]|[[User talk:Piotrus| reply here]] 14:42, 14 November 2025 (UTC)

::PPS. It is suprising that all literature I see seems to ignore Libionka and Weinbaum’s book and repeat Bednarczyk’s claims… [[User:Piotrus|Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus]]|[[User talk:Piotrus| reply here]] 14:50, 14 November 2025 (UTC)

::From [https://jcpa.org/article/heroes-hucksters-storytellers-jewish-military-union-zzw/ Heroes, Hucksters, and Storytellers: On the Jewish Military Union (ŻZW)]:

::{{Cquote|Two resistance organizations, the ŻZW (Żydowski Związek Wojskowy or Jewish Military Union) and the ŻOB (Żydowska Organizacja Bojowa or Jewish Combat Organization) took control of the ghetto. They built bunkers and fighting posts and executed a number of collaborators, including Jewish police officers and members of a resistance organization called Żagiew, which was used by the Germans as a trap to ensnare Jews}}

::In the review, this information is presented as fact. Please comment, I don’t understand this. [[User:Pessimist2006|Pessimist]] ([[User talk:Pessimist2006|talk]]) 19:18, 14 November 2025 (UTC)

==Did you know nomination==

This article was edited to contain a total or partial translation of Żagiew (czasopismo) from the Polish Wikipedia. Consult the history of the original page to see a list of its authors.

1940 or 1943? Polish and English pages differ… — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.65.48.125 (talk) 09:04, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

This article is Polish propaganda and has no truth to it! The idea that Jews collaborated with Nazis in the Warsaw ghetto is fictional and supports only the polish victimhood narrative that poles didn’t collaborate as much as Jews did, basically holocaust revisionism which is a form of denial. 2607:FB91:19B7:4215:1021:E39D:FAEE:61C9 (talk) 07:47, 5 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

This is fully recognized and documented in Jewish historiography as well, for example by Holocaust Historical Society[1] Cloud200 (talk) 12:25, 5 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Dreamcatcher25 Based on what you recently told me on pl wiki, this article may not be factually correct? Can you take a look? Should it be deleted or can you rewrite it? _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:28, 11 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Piotrus Unfortunately, in its current form, the article presents a completely inaccurate account of “Żagiew.” In reality, “Żagiew” was a clandestine magazine published in the Warsaw Ghetto in 1942–1943 by assimilated Jews. While it is true that Żagiew was opposed by the Jewish Combat Organization, which suspected some of its publishers of collaboration with the Nazis, the description of “Żagiew” as a Gestapo agency with “over a thousand Jewish secret agents” and close connections with Group 13 is a historical fabrication. This narrative was invented by Tadeusz Bednarczyk [pl], who was also involved in the long-standing falsification of the history of the Jewish Military Union (ŻZW). Unfortunately, this hoax has been repeated since the 1960s in a relatively large number of works by Polish historians, some of whom are otherwise credible. The true story of “Żagiew” was thoroughly examined by Dariusz Libionka and Laurence Weinbaum in their book Bohaterowie, hochsztaplerzy, opowiadacze. Wokół Żydowskiego Związku Wojskowego (English: “Heroes, Hucksters, and Storytellers: On the Jewish Military Union”) from 2011. Based on their findings, I have fully revised the article on “Żagiew” on the Polish Wikipedia and am ready to make similar changes here as well (but no earlier than next week though).Dreamcatcher25 (talk) 08:43, 11 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Dreamcatcher25 Thank you for rewriting this. Can you take a look at the articles mentioning Żagiew and see if they need corrections? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/%C5%BBagiew For example, Hotel Polski talks about Żagiew network, and has three references… _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 14:03, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

PS. But why did ŻOB call Żagiew a vile publication and executed its publisher? _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 14:18, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe we should clarify which scholars repead Bednarczyk’s theory? Tadeusz Piotrowski (sociologist) cited in the article is one. [2] (article in pl:Kwartalnik Historii Żydów) by Maciej Wójcicki (non-notable historian?) also seems to treat his view as correct. Not seeing much in English literature about this. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 14:42, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

PPS. It is suprising that all literature I see seems to ignore Libionka and Weinbaum’s book and repeat Bednarczyk’s claims… _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 14:50, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

From Heroes, Hucksters, and Storytellers: On the Jewish Military Union (ŻZW):

“

Two resistance organizations, the ŻZW (Żydowski Związek Wojskowy or Jewish Military Union) and the ŻOB (Żydowska Organizacja Bojowa or Jewish Combat Organization) took control of the ghetto. They built bunkers and fighting posts and executed a number of collaborators, including Jewish police officers and members of a resistance organization called Żagiew, which was used by the Germans as a trap to ensnare Jews

”

In the review, this information is presented as fact. Please comment, I don’t understand this. Pessimist (talk) 19:18, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]

… that the Jewish underground newspaper from the Warsaw Ghetto, Żagiew, has been misrepresented as a Gestapo organization? Source: Libionka & Weinbaum 2012, p. 687, as cited in the article

5x expanded by Dreamcatcher25 (talk).
Number of QPQs required: 2. DYK is currently in unreviewed backlog mode and nominator has 575 past nominations.

_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 14:32, 14 November 2025 (UTC).[reply]

Talk:Żagiew: Difference between revisions – Wikipedia

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