User talk:Stevenbdolins: Difference between revisions

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LMK if you have questions (I’ll see if you reply here). [[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]] (Pigsonthewing); [[User talk:Pigsonthewing|Talk to Andy]]; [[Special:Contributions/Pigsonthewing|Andy’s edits]] 14:51, 10 January 2026 (UTC)

:Thank you so much for updating this page.

:Regarding information about Donald, I can reference Robert Sacre’s liner notes for the Gay family CD on Gospel Friend Records (although its not listed in the reference section so I’m not sure how to do that). I can add reviews (in Living Blues and Rhythm & Blues) for his compact disc. I also co-authored a book with Donald that will be published by the University of Chicago Press in August 2026. I can reference this book but would it be a COI? If I can reference it, should I wait until its available?

:Regarding their Chicago roots, I can reference Boyer, Carpenter, and/or Marovich.

:Regarding their race, I suppose a photo would answer that question. Or I can say they were an “American Black gospel singing group”? Or both? What do you think is best?

:Regarding a photo, I can get the family’s permission to use one of the sisters publicity shots. However, I was having trouble figuring out how to add a photograph to Wikimedia Commons that makes a photograph available on Wikipedia but requires family permission to use it. Any pointers?

:Thank you again. [[User:Stevenbdolins|Stevenbdolins]] ([[User talk:Stevenbdolins#top|talk]]) 15:44, 10 January 2026 (UTC)

Hello, Stevenbdolins, and welcome to Wikipedia! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Below are some pages you might find helpful. For a user-friendly interactive help forum, see the Wikipedia Teahouse.

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, please see our help pages, and if you can’t find what you are looking for there, please feel free to ask me on my talk page or place {{Help me}} on this page and someone will drop by to help. Again, welcome! tony 06:02, 17 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Stevenbdolins. We welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things you have written about on the page Erwin Helfer, you may have a conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a conflict of interest may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the conflict of interest guideline and FAQ for article subjects for more information. We ask that you:

In addition, you are required by the Wikimedia Foundation‘s terms of use to disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution which forms all or part of work for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation. See Wikipedia:Paid-contribution disclosure.

Also, editing for the purpose of advertising, publicizing, or promoting anyone or anything is not permitted. Thank you. Tacyarg (talk) 23:32, 22 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I am aware of the wikipedia COI policies. I thought that adding information about Helfer was important, including correcting his birthdate, since he is an accomplished pianist and his page was virtually empty. I only added facts with sources, I was unbiased, and I disclosed my COI on his Talk Page.

I ran into trouble adding three of his honors: a Nelson Algren Award, a Jazz Institute of Chicago Lifetime Achievement Award, and a street sign in Chicago. The Nelson Algren Committee, JIC, and city of Chicago websites do not archive their award winners. I could add photographs of these awards and I may be able to find a JIC program with documentation. Would that suffice? Or do I just leave these awards off his page? Stevenbdolins (talk) 16:32, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, as someone with a CoI, you should not edit the article directly, but request changes on the article’s Talk page. You can use the edit request wizard for this. Yes, if there are no reliable, independent, published sources for some of his awards, these should not be included in the article. Tacyarg (talk) 16:57, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

That is helpful. Thank you!

I have one other question on another topic. What about creating a new page where I also have a COI. Do I create it in my sandbox and request help? Stevenbdolins (talk) 17:04, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Glad it’s useful. Let me know if you have any difficulties with it. For creating articles about people you know, use the articles for creation process. Tacyarg (talk) 17:22, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

A few more questions. In your opinion, what is needed to remove the Maintenance template? Other users to verify what I wrote? Other users to add more references/sources? I am not entirely clear since what I wrote is accurate and unbiased (according to me). Stevenbdolins (talk) 17:45, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I wrote a draft of a wikipedia page in my sandbox. If you have the time, can you let me know if i did it correctly and will people look at it and comment? Stevenbdolins (talk) 21:03, 23 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Tacyarg:—“as someone with a CoI, you should not edit the article directly”

You might want to read the quotations on User:Pigsonthewing/About self. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy’s edits 15:26, 7 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Pigsonthewing. I normally phrase this as “should not normally … ” and signpost to the guidance; I’ll be more careful. Tacyarg (talk) 07:04, 8 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by Dan arndt were: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

Dan arndt (talk) 19:18, 25 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Stevenbdolins!
Having an article draft declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we’d love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Dan arndt (talk) 19:18, 25 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by MurielMary was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

MurielMary (talk) 09:42, 5 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

I am still confused because the Gay Sisters page meets wikipedia criteria for notability.

1) Has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works appearing in sources that are reliable, not self-published, and are independent of the musician or ensemble itself. << I have referenced Boyer, Carpenter, Heilbut, and Marovich. These are the most prestigious and relaible references on American gospel music.

2 and 3) Has had a single or album on any country’s national music chart. Has had a record certified gold or higher in at least one country.

<< Carpenter claims “God Will Take Care of You” would have been a platinum record in today’s music world. I didn’t quote this because it seemed like boasting and difficult to prove.

4) Has received non-trivial coverage in independent reliable sources of an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in at least one sovereign country. <<Performed at the first gospel music concert at Carnegie Hall in 1950. Provided two primary sources. They also performed at a number of auditoriums in the US, including the Apollo Theater. They also performed at he Houston Astrodome. In 1976, they were honored by the Smithsonian Institute for their contributions to the advancement of Gospel music in America.

5) Has released two or more albums on a major record label or on one of the more important indie labels (i.e., an independent label with a history of more than a few years, and with a roster of performers, many of whom are independently notable) << Recorded for Dolphin, Savoy, Decca, and Chess … can’t do any better than that!

7) Has become one of the most prominent representatives of a notable style or the most prominent of the local scene of a city; note that the subject must still meet all ordinary Wikipedia standards, including verifiability. << Evelyn and Geraldine were two of the best gospel pianists who ever lived. See Boyer and Heilbut.

10) Has performed music for a work of media that is notable, such as a theme for a network television show, performance in a television show or notable film, inclusion on a notable compilation album. << Their version of “God Will Take Care of You” was used in the Henty Louis Gates documentary on gospel music.

11) Has been placed in rotation nationally by a major radio or music television network. << Difficult to prove but they have received major radio airplay in the 50’s, 60’s, and 70’s. They received radio play from 2004-2016.

I don’t know what else I could do. It would be a travesty to exclude them from Wikipedia. Please help and give me more guidance. Stevenbdolins (talk) 15:37, 5 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. I can’t help on this, but you might want to ask at the teahouse. Women in Red might also be able to help. Best wishes, Tacyarg (talk) 18:17, 5 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, I’ll keep trying. Steven Stevenbdolins (talk) 21:56, 5 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

I’ve done some editing on the draft. Are there obituaries of any of the sisters? Tacyarg (talk) 00:27, 6 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your edits and help! I greatly appreciate it.

I don’t have their obituaries. I can search. I think I have one or two of the church funeral program(s). I can look.

However, you asking about the obituaries triggered some ideas and additional information that I can add to this page. Hayes and Laughton and Kot documented that Evelyn accompanied The Soul Stirrers (with and without Sam Cooke) on Specialty and The Staple Singers on United. Evelyn accompanied other notable gospel singers, including Mahalia and Cleophus Robinson, but there is no written documentation. Geraldine accompanied The Soul Stirrers and several other notable groups but there is no written documentation. I won’t add facts without written documentation.

After making these additions, should I contact teahouse and Women in Red? Do I share my list of reasons for meeting the wikipedia criteria for notability or let them be the judge?

Thanks again! Stevenbdolins (talk) 16:48, 6 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

I made a few edits to bring the article into house style, and added a bunch of categories. I’ve also added a sentence or two to the article about the Amazing Grace album.

A couple of points about Donald need citations; do you have sources you can use?

There are also some things that can be assumed, but are not stated (nor cited); were the women Black, and were they originally from Chicago? If you have sources, please update the article.

LMK if you have questions (I’ll see if you reply here). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy’s edits 14:51, 10 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much for updating this page.

Regarding information about Donald, I can reference Robert Sacre’s liner notes for the Gay family CD on Gospel Friend Records (although its not listed in the reference section so I’m not sure how to do that). I can add reviews (in Living Blues and Rhythm & Blues) for his compact disc. I also co-authored a book with Donald that will be published by the University of Chicago Press in August 2026. I can reference this book but would it be a COI? If I can reference it, should I wait until its available?

Regarding their Chicago roots, I can reference Boyer, Carpenter, and/or Marovich.

Regarding their race, I suppose a photo would answer that question. Or I can say they were an “American Black gospel singing group”? Or both? What do you think is best?

Regarding a photo, I can get the family’s permission to use one of the sisters publicity shots. However, I was having trouble figuring out how to add a photograph to Wikimedia Commons that makes a photograph available on Wikipedia but requires family permission to use it. Any pointers?

Thank you again. Stevenbdolins (talk) 15:44, 10 January 2026 (UTC)[reply]

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