Talk:Ekklesia (Sparta): Difference between revisions

 

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==This article needs to be renamed==

==This article needs to be renamed==

The official name for the popular assembly at Sparta&mdash;either ‘the Ekklesia’ or ‘the Apella’&mdash;is disputed.<ref>Schulz 2009, p. 335 n. 9: “Ob die Volksversammlung in Sparta Apella oder Ekklesia hieß, ist umstritten”.</ref> Modern scholarly consensus had favored the name ‘Apella’; as recently as 1972, Ste Croix could declare that the “Spartan Assembly is still commonly referred to as ‘the Apella'”.<ref>Ste Croix 1972, p. 346.</ref> However following Wade-Gery 1958, Andrewes 1970, and Ste. Croix 1972, scholarly consensus shifted in favor of ‘Ekklesia’. More recently Welwei 1997, 2000, and 2004 has revived the dispute, advocating in favor of ‘Apella’.<ref>Luther 2006, p. 74; Nafissi 2010, p. 95.</ref>

The official name for the popular assembly at Sparta&mdash;either ‘the Ekklesia’ or ‘the Apella’&mdash;is disputed.<ref>Schulz 2009, p. 335 n. 9: “Ob die Volksversammlung in Sparta Apella oder Ekklesia hieß, ist umstritten”.</ref> Modern scholarly consensus had favored the name ‘Apella’; as recently as 1972, Ste Croix could declare that the “Spartan Assembly is still commonly referred to as ‘the Apella'”.<ref>Ste Croix 1972, p. 346.</ref> However following Wade-Gery 1958, Andrewes 1970, and Ste. Croix 1972, scholarly consensus shifted in favor of ‘Ekklesia’. More recently Welwei 1997, 2000, and 2004 has revived the dispute, advocating in favor of ‘Apella’.<ref>Luther 2006, p. 74; Nafissi 2010, p. 95.</ref>

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===Proposal===

===Proposal===

Unless there are any objections, I intend to rewrite the “Name” section, and rename this article to “Spartan Assembly”. 12:59, 2 November 2025 (UTC)

Unless there are any objections, I intend to rewrite the “Name” section, and rename this article to “Spartan Assembly”. :, November 2025 (UTC)

====Comments?====

====Comments?====

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What does that mean? Doesn’t make any sense to me. Fresheneesz (talk) 22:38, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

“There is a single reference to a “small assembly” at Sparta, but nothing is known as to its nature or competence. The term apella does not occur in extant Spartan inscriptions, though two decrees of Gythium belonging to the Roman period refer to the μεγάλαι ἀπέλλαι”

What is this talking about? It seems very out of place. Is this suggesting that the Sparta might not actually have had the Apella? Fresheneesz (talk) 22:42, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, they never used the word. I corrected the article. T8612 (talk) 12:41, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The word usually appears in plural.There was a festival named “apellai”. Jestmoon(talk) 12:50, 24 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skias_%28Sparta%29#/media/Datei:Map_of_Archaeological_site_of_Sparta.jpg

Showing the locations of the Skias and the Agora might help people to picture it.

—KimYunmi (talk) 16:12, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Colleagues {Paul August] & [T8612]

We seem to be getting ourselves into a bit of a tangle between the meaning (and words used) in the article and the mechanics of the reference to [EB1911]. I’m trying to deal with the second of these by avoiding use of (https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/1911_Encyclopædia_Britannica/Apella s.v. Apella) and instead using an extra link to the main wikilink to [EB1911] which is at the end of the first sentence to the paragraph called Structure.

Can those with a much better understanding of the meaning of the article fix this? Maybe the words at the beginning of the para titled Name can be changed and/or a link to the [EB1911] dropped.

Regards

ArbieP ArbieP (talk) 10:49, 29 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hey ArbieP, I’m working on an entire rewrite of this article which will, in fact, eliminate any need for a cite to EB 1911. Paul August ☎ 12:01, 29 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The official name for the popular assembly at Sparta—either ‘the Ekklesia’ or ‘the Apella’—is disputed.^[1] Modern scholarly consensus had favored the name ‘Apella’; as recently as 1972, Ste Croix could declare that the “Spartan Assembly is still commonly referred to as ‘the Apella'”.^[2] However following Wade-Gery 1958, Andrewes 1970, and Ste. Croix 1972, scholarly consensus shifted in favor of ‘Ekklesia’.^[3] More recently, Welwei 1997, 2000, and 2004 has revived the dispute, advocating in favor of ‘Apella’.^[4]

• Andrewes, A. (1970), p. 134 in A Historical Commentary on Thucydides. Vol. 4: Books V25-VII A. W. Gomme, A. Andrewes, and K. J. Dover (eds.), Oxford University Press, Oxford, 1970. ISBN 9780198141785.

• Luther, Andreas, (2006), “Der Name der Volksversammlung in Sparta”, in Das frühe Sparta, Andrew Luther, Mischa Meier, and Lukas Thommen (eds.), Franz Steiner Verlag, Munich, 2006, pp. 73-88.

• Nafissi, Massimo (2010), “The Great Rhetra (Plut. Lyc. 6): A Retrospective and Intentional Construct?”, in Intentional History: Spinning Time in Ancient Greece, Lin Foxhall, Hans-Joachim Gehrke, and Nino Luraghi (eds.), Franz Steiner Verlag, 2010.

• Wade-Gery (1958), Essays in Greek History Basil Blackwell, Oxford, 1958. Internet Archive

• Welwei, Karl-Wilhelm (1997), “Apella oder Ekklesia? Zur Bezeichnung der spartanischen Volksversammlung”, in Rheinisches Museum für Philologie 140 (1997), H. 3/4, 242-249. JSTOR 41234282.

• Welwei, Karl-Wilhelm (2000), Polis und Arché: kleine Schriften zu Gesellschafts- und Herrschaftsstrukturen in der griechischen Welt, Franz Steiner Verlag, 2000. ISBN 9783515077590, ISBN 3-515-07759-6.

• Welwei, Karl-Wilhelm (2004), Sparta. Aufstieg und Niedergang einer antiken Großmacht, Klett-Cotta Verlag, Stuttgart 2004.

Unless there are any objections, I intend to rewrite the “Name” section, and rename this article to “Spartan Assembly”. Paul August ☎ 13:23, 3 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]